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Manatee Principal Embroiled In School Prayer Dispute
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Published: April 29, 2008
NORTH MANATEE — A Washington-based group that advocates the separation of church and state claims that teachers and the principal at a Manatee County school regularly take part in prayer meetings on the school grounds.
Americans United for Separation of Church and State is preparing to file a complaint with the school district stating that school staff at Mills Elementary School regularly participate in prayer meetings and that Principal Mike Rio has announced the meetings over the public address system.
The complaint states that Rio took part in one meeting at the school on the National Day of Prayer, which is held annually on the first Thursday in May.
School employees taking part in on-campus prayer meetings with students violates the separation of church and state enshrined in the Constitution, said Joe Conn, a spokesman for the group.
"The courts have been very strict when it comes to kids: School officials and teachers are not allowed to influence kids," Conn said. "It's definitely a violation of the Constitution to pressure kids to pray or to make a decision about prayer."
The group's complaint echoes that of fired Mills teacher Mary Cropsey, who said Rio placed Christian items around the flagpole at the school in Parrish and joined others there for prayer.
The claim was made after Cropsey was accused of helping a student cheat on the Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test and placed on administrative leave. Manatee County School Board members ruled that the evidence did not support the claim of cheating, but Cropsey was fired because she did not cooperate with investigation.
Rio could not be reached for comment Monday.
For decades, youth ministries in the United States have organized "Meet Me at the Pole" gatherings as a way to have group prayer before school starts. In fact, the movement has grown so large that the National Network of Youth Ministries, which organizes an event each September, has its own Web site and asks thousands of students to report on their experience.
"If they're talking about 'Meet Me at the Pole,' that goes on everywhere across the country," said John Bowen, the school board attorney, who said he has not received the complaint. "That activity is within grounds of the First Amendment as long as school personnel do not participate and only are present for supervision."
Bowen also said schools are permitted to publicize prayer events if requested to by students.
"Just as any other student events might be announced over the intercom, principals are free to announce that," Bowen said.
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Reader Comments
Posted by ( TylerDurden ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:02 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Who cares. As long as no one was required to pray... maybe a few kids walked away in a better more peaceful mindset.
Though, it is funny that they picked the most phallic thing on campus to pray around.
Mazal Tov מזל טוב
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:11 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
A Washington-based group that advocates seperation of church and state...I suggest that maybe this Washington based group also begin to advocate the morals and virtues that are lost in schools because religion is taken out of the fold.
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Posted by ( jdc1483 ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:12 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
What I want to know is what are these anti-prayer groups so afraid of??? It's not prayer in schools that have brought on so much violence, shootings, hate, etc. All this started happening when prayer was TAKEN OUT of school!
And just because a Principle or Teacher chooses to pray with other students doesnt mean that he or she is "pressuring" anyone else to do it. Geez...someone needs to tell these people to get a clue!
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Posted by ( 1madvet ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:18 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
No where in the constitution does the words " seperation of church and state" exist. What does exist is the " government will not prohibit the freedom of religion". But the constitution has been thrown in the trash with the rest of the country. Better stock up on ammo, boys. The fight is a coming.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:38 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
1madvet
Dont forget the beer too...what good is ammo without beer?
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Posted by ( Yankee ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:44 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
This is a good thing. Prayer strengthens you and helps you. It does for me anyway. When I'm going through a rough time, I pray and I feel so much peace. I must agree though with JDC1483, it is not prayer that is contributing to the high crimes in these schools, it's the lack of it or better yet, none of it.
God bless these students who meet at the pole and are not ashamed of the gospel.
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:44 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
1madvet, thanks for your service in the military, but please, read the constitution before lecturing on the subject. You are correct that it does not state the words "separation of church and state" in the constitution, but neither does it state that this is a "christian nation" in the constitution, either. The first amendment to the constitution states: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." Please note that it does not say "government will not prohibit the freedom of religion" but rather that the state cannot prohibit the PRACTICE of religion by any person. The difference is that anyone may practice any religion that they choose to practice, but the state, and therefore the school (as a state supported entity) cannot promote any religious activity. Promotion of a religious activity would be establishment of religion, and is clearly not allowed by the First Amendment.
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Posted by ( Claylisa ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:54 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Jesus freaks never get it.
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Posted by ( BrianA ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:59 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
>>"....to advocate the morals and virtues that are lost in schools because religion is taken out of the fold."<<
Why does one need 'religion' to be virtuous and moral? I guess if you are a low-expectation-having creature that looks forward to death...
....and using violence to defend Christianity? W.W.J.D ---- Who would Jesus Destroy ?? Wait, maybe if I close my eyes and talk to myself things will make sense.
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Posted by ( DeadCenter ) on April 29, 2008 at 8:59 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Thanks for your profound comment claylisa...
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:03 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
BrianA, you are forgetting that religion is the opiate of the masses. There are some who truly live a Christ-like life, and make others wish to live like them based on example, while others profess to preach the words of Jesus while not living anything like the words they preach.
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Posted by ( 1madvet ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:04 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
My bad. Didn't think about the school as being a government institution. Guess they were just schools at one time. Anyway. What say we all meet at Rick's about noon for a beer?
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:11 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
1madvet, if we all had your attitude, the world would be a better place! If I wasn't working today, I would buy you that beer at Ricks!
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Posted by ( DeadCenter ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:11 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
commentcava...I am not the best Christian around, however, the amendment is vague enough that it could be interpreted that a Christians' rights are being interfered with since they are not being allowed their freedom of religion.
Around the country, we have numerous schools/universitys that are teaching Islam, Buddism, etc.
Why should Christianity be treated differently?
A classic liberal comment when criticism is made regarding movies/Tv etc is "if it bothers you, don't watch"
I feel the same about theis issue...
What exactly is the evil that will arise from voluntary prayer in school? And where specifically does the Constitution say that it is unconstitutional? One letter from Thomas Jefferson and here we are...
One last thing, all of our laws eminating from the Constitution are based on Christian principles...
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:14 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Claylisa
Maybe Jesus "freaks" do get, and it is you that doesn't, but I guess no one will know until the the day they pass...good luck with that.
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Posted by ( ctownhood ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:21 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts....are you suggesting that Christians are the only ones who have "morals and virtues"? I am an Atheist, and I live a much more "christian-like" lifestyle than many bible bangers I know
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:22 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
madvet
Can we meet at the flagpole for prayer before that frosty beverage? I hear Rick's has wonderful seafood as well. Would you be okay if we invited the heathens as well (what else do they have to live for)?
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Posted by ( RangerDave ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:26 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Good for the principal...
1 Thessalonians 5:17 says, "pray continually"
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:39 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
DeadCenter, please explain how christians or any other group are being denied their freedom to practice their religion? You just don't seem to understand that individuals are free to practice any religion they choose, but for a state sponsored institution like a public school, that entity (and therefore the staff and employees of that institution) cannot promote any religious practice because that would be the state establishing a religion. If Mr. Rio wants to practice christianity, he may do so on his time, but not on the paid time at the school. His blatant placement of religious symbols around the flagpole was a flagrant abuse of his power and authority, and seemed to say that one must practice christianity in this school to gain acceptance. What if he were Wiccan, and promoted pagan practices? Would you be denying his religious freedom by not allowing it on school property? Does your work allow you paid time off to attend church? Or time off to pray 5 times a day to Allah? No, but they must accomodate your religious practices, so long as they do not interfere with you performing your duties.
I do not follow how you can say you are being denied rights, when it is so painfully obvious that Christians are not being persecuted. To quote Dolly Parton, "Get down of your cross, people down here need the wood".
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Posted by ( whasup ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:44 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I'll bet all the christian arguments would go out the window if they had to tolerate muslims and jews practicing their religion at the flagpole every morning.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:50 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I have a splendid idea..i will bring a sampling of jewish people and some muslims, toss in a couple hard to find mormons...we head to ricks, strap the gloves on commentcava and DeadCenter, and have a sanctioned boxing event. Winner gets eternal bragging rights (which for DeadCenter may be a little longer, but hey who is counting)
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 9:59 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Boilercolts, only one problem. I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person! Actually, neither of us would change the other's mind, so the battle would be pointless, and what makes you think that I might not belive in eternity? I believe in America, and that is my point.
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Posted by ( Claylisa ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:01 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts...they don't get it.
When will they stop trying to force and influence others in these venues? Why is it that your WWJD-folks have to constant try to push religion into public school systems? Go to a Catholic school, or private religious learning campus. No one is saying you Jesus freaks can't practice your religion in this country. Just keep it out of state and government run establishments so the ammendment has some semblance of correctness.
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Posted by ( noneya ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:01 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
jdc1483- Religion does not advocate violence and hate? Have you even read that bible of yours? It is the most sadistic, hate filled, violent and murderous novel I have ever read. It doesn't just advocate violence, it demands it. Most of society's ills can be linked to religion, every religion. Not a lack of.
Yankee- You don't want the people who aren't around the pole blessed? Why is that?
1madvet- You've read that bible. Point proven with your post.
But on the issue. Should people be allowed to pray around a pole? I don't see why not. They're protected by their rights to do so. Plus, if you've ever even read the bible, you'd know that these people must are terrified half to death. If praying to their God who is known for demanding millions of people be stoned to death or sends men to villages to slash everyone, including babies, to shreds or floods the entire earth killing every living thing except a guy, his family and apparently two of every single animal on earth, makes them feel safe from his murderous wrath... Well pray on.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:09 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
noneya
Apparently someone stopped at the the end of the Old Testament. It's ok, I bet that copy of L. Ron Hubbard's Dianetics is a real page turner (feel free to insert laughter and sarcastic tone when reading that last part).
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Posted by ( Claylisa ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:10 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
whasup...awesome point. It's all fun and games for the Jesus freaks until, a Muslim lays down his prayer mat to the east at that pole.
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Posted by ( BrianA ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:11 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
>>BrianA, you are forgetting that religion is the opiate of the masses.<<
No, I haven't forgot that old saying...I just wish for a day when people accept the fact that everything cannot be explained empirically, and be content with it.
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Posted by ( jagaka2 ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:15 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Go to church to pray - go to school to get an education. Pretty simple.
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Posted by ( TylerDurden ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:19 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
RangerDave
I have always been more of a fan of...
EZECHIEL 25:17
[The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.
Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children... and they shall know that I am the Lord, when I shall lay my vengeance upon them]
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:19 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Claylisa
Let me be the first to appoligize for whatever has scarred you in the past. Your hatred toward religion is an obvious sign of deep seeded psychological issues. If you want, we can meet 1madvet at Ricks for that beer and talk about it...i can offer a friendly ear and maybe even a hug!
I am praying for you!
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Posted by ( noneya ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:23 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts- Oh is the Old Testament irrelevant once the New Testament came along? Ha-ha.
I read both and the New Testament is just as unbelievable and disgusting as the old. You can't just erase the Old Testament because the New is slightly less murderous or hideous. It is "God's" own words after all. Those words and demands to kill just about everyone are perfect right?
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Posted by ( Gigi1182 ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:27 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
This washington based group needs to keep their business in washington and leave Florida alone. If a principal wants to extend an invite for a prayer meeting with teachers and students, he can- as long as he doesn't REQUIRE or FORCE anyone to do it.
Too many people in this day and age are so obsessed with offending other people that theyre ignoring a person's basic rights as a human being.
How about I sue the state board of education for FORCING my kid to take a standardized test, even though I don't believe in them?
Once again, the world has gone to hell.
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Posted by ( noneya ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:30 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts- I don't have enough money to join the L Ron Hubbard brigade. Plus, I find them to be just as creepy as Christians, Catholics, Muslims etc..(feel free to insert one raised eyebrow that indicates lame attempt at sarcasm made by you here)
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Posted by ( jagaka2 ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:30 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Freedom is the distance between church and state.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:31 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Noneya - "Scepticism is the beginning of Faith.” Oscar Wilde
Keep up the good work, I will be praying for you my little mustard seed (though I need not a flagpole nor a school to do so).
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Posted by ( noneya ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:36 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts- Ha-ha. I can't beat being called a little mustardseed. I just can't beat that. But I can match your Wilde with my Nietzsche
"All the beauty and sublimity we have bestowed upon real and imaginary things, I will reclaim as the property and product of man: as his fairest apology: Man as poet, as thinker, as God, as love, as power: with what regal liberality he has lavished gifts upon things so as to impoverish himself and make himself feel wretched! His most unselfish act hitherto has been to admire and worship and to know how to conceal from himself that it was he who created what he admired." -Friedrich Nietzsche
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Posted by ( jassack ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:38 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
It appears as if the principal's involvement is more the issue than the event itself. I guess it's better if the teachers/administrators are preying on the students instead of praying with them.
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Posted by ( pamsdolls ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:45 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
When someone is hurt badly - or a family is suffering what do people do? PRAY for them. Our freedom to worship the way we chose should not be limited to time or place as long as it is not hurting another. It should not matter who is praying as long as it is not hurting others or they are not forcing others to pray! Go and look at alot of our government buildings and you will find the word God all over them! I feel that when they started taking prayer out of schools that was the start of the lost of control of our children - then it was that children no longer had to say the pledge - children today respect nothing or no one - not even themselves. I pray that someone starts listening to the now discriminated majority and not the powerful minorities.
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Posted by ( Claylisa ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:49 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boil,
Let me be the first to appoligize for whatever has scarred YOU in the past. Your freakness for religion and desire to peddle it any and everywhere are an obvious sign of deep seeded attachment to the unknown.
If you want, I can meet you and 1madvet at Ricks for that beer if you are even allowed to drink one, (being a Jesus freak and all)...I won't offer a friendly ear or a hug though. Ask the bartender for that.
Don't forget to bring that Gideons Bible they gave you in the bing by the way. Sure there will be some heathens you can spit up on at the bar, with your preachy rubbish.
I am LMAO AT you!
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:58 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Why do you believe that they have "taken prayer out of school"? Every child and employee is free to pray at the school at any time they so desire, but the school and the employees, or any other student for that matter, may not impose their religion on another. Big difference. Your right to pray only ends when you force or coerce someone else to do the same.
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Posted by ( jagaka2 ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:04 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
You believers don't have enough churches? I've never seen so many churches in my life till moving to the south. I think you can leave the schools alone. You're not as persecuted as you think.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:09 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Claylisa
You can't triple stamp a double stamp
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:13 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I have a peaceful solution...seperate but equal school. Believers and non-believers....it worked in the past RIGHT?!?
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Posted by ( wmgerald518 ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:14 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
It is not that they wish to have prayer in our public schools in as much as they only wish to have christian prayers and seemingly only christian values not the values of all other religions.
Freedom of religion, in my view, means also the freedom to leave it alone.
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Posted by ( Gen2Native ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:30 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
One does not have to be religious to be a moral person. The Golden Rule (Do Unto Others...) is universal and I have seen a website with all its versions.
I believe what turns many people off (myself included) is the aggressive "witnessing" that so many christians and other religions practice. I was taught by my mother that I should share my faith by example/actions and not by telling people what they should do. I have experienced many a "hard sell" by people who assume I have no religious faith because I do not throw it in other people's faces.
This may be why the school is receiving poor publicity.
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Posted by ( commentcava ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:37 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
boilercolts, there is that choice. One can send your child to any parochial school (at your own expense) or send them to public school for free. If you want your children to have religious traning, it is your right (and duty) to do so on your own dime. Maybe your rich and powerful church can cough up the dough to pay for free schooling for all, as they pay no taxes, unlike any other business in the United States.
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Posted by ( RS57 ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:43 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
The unwinnable argument rears its' ugly head again. If anyone wants to practice their religion in a voluntary manner go right ahead. I do not care. However if this principal is doing so on school time, he is wrong. This is exactly why religion is for church, home, and comparative classes. It is not for the public forum, and definitely not in Public schools. They should remain secular. Parents have choices; homeschooling or religiously based schools.I just wonder if all of the screaming to the heavens Christians who post here back up the rhetoric with action? A quote for you " Yea what you do to the least of my brethren, ye do unto me". I see a lot of the so called heathens following that, and to be fair a lot of Christians too, but it seems that there should be a lot more of YOU involved. You know; food pantries,kitchens, homeless shelters, animal groups, etc. Make sure that action does follow the words. A bit of redundancy but an important point.
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Posted by ( jagaka2 ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:47 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Maybe the principal should have been a minister. The pay might not be as good though.
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Posted by ( boilercolts ) on April 29, 2008 at 11:51 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
HA but evolution can be taught in school...oooohhhh the irony
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Posted by ( Gladiator ) on April 29, 2008 at 12:35 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
teachers are not allowed to influence kids so states the law. I thought teaching has a slight influence. I would rather see them praying than having sex with them. Where are they when that happens. Separation of kinky desires and state.
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Posted by ( cshultz110 ) on April 29, 2008 at 2:23 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
commentcava - You make some interesting points. Here are some thoughts . . .
On "One can send your child to any parochial school (at your own expense) or send them to public school for free. If you want your children to have religious traning, it is your right (and duty) to do so on your own dime." As a tax paying citizen it IS on my dime and I shouldn't have to pay extra for it!!! I see nothing wrong with a free public secular and a free public non-secular education!
On "The difference is that anyone may practice any religion that they choose to practice, but the state, and therefore the school (as a state supported entity) cannot promote any religious activity. Promotion of a religious activity would be establishment of religion, and is clearly not allowed by the First Amendment" - That is not entirely correct. It states that schools cannot promote one religion over another. That is why school music programs at Christmas time (oops, sorry, winter holiday time) play christmas songs as well as Hannukah, Kwanza and any other sect that might attend their school as to not offend or show a preference.
As for your belief that a Christian should live the life and not just talk about it - I COMPLETELY AGREE!!!
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Posted by ( cshultz110 ) on April 29, 2008 at 2:37 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
A few thoughts for everyone -
For those of you who believe that this nation was not built on Christianity . . . Please send all of your money (that says "In God We Trust") to 1234 iamabaffoon St., Tampa . . . . SERIOUSLY, this is where we find out how convicted to your belief you really are!!! If you truly believe that this country was not based on Christianity, stop spending money now!!! It goes against your beliefs!!!
For those who wonder how Christians would feel if we (paraphrasing) had other religions shoved in our face at school . . . um, they do! Christians can't wear hats or headwear, but the muslims can everyday!!! The wiccans can wear their black clothing and makeup. The Jews can wear jewelry, but if a Christian wears a Cross around their neck, they have to put it under their shirt and they are not allowed to wear a religious t-shirt, so yes, it happens everyday!!!
Finally, There is nothing wrong with a teacher or administrator praying WITH the students at an event so long as it is student led, they are praying on their own and not trying to "save" someone and they are not forcing anyone to join in against their will.
By the way . . . No, prayer is not taken out of school from the respect that students can pray on their own, but not be led by faculty of any sort (I agree with this by the way). Where I have a problem is that we have quietly discriminated against Christian students doing this practice through tormenting of the student, non-religious bullying and other means to make the Christian student feel ashamed of doing it, which in my book is the same thing as surpressing THE FREEDOM OF RELIGION for the individual!!!
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Posted by ( c_jay ) on April 29, 2008 at 4:49 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
pamsdolls,
the first thing you do when someone is not doing well you pray for theim and their family etc.
That is how you choose to deal with it. Others may not deal with it the same way.
You have probably seen lots of posts along the nature (of my first paragraph). And there are many more posts who you see do not have any prayers.
Plus there are many non-posts of people who read these (our) posts and choose not to even get involved. Chances are 50/50 that the non-posters don't care to pray for someone or the family.
Of course we would never know that, since they don't post. (I think that kinda goes without saying).
At the end of the day, people will either pray or not pray for someone depending on how comfortable they are doing it in public or otherwise.
As far as including prayers in school, that's fine, but don't expect those students who do not wish to participate to do just that. The only problem is, young minds are very impressionable. They might give in to the pressure of praying because they want to fit in.
And while this country was "founded on religious" what-cha-ma-call-it, most first settlers escaped from Europe due to religious prosecution.
They were not able to practice their religious believes in Europe, so they came here (to practice it here). But then became real judmental (exactly the opposite of what their Gods wanted them to be) when someone didn't agree with their religious outlook.
It is a business. Always has been. Of course the Roman Catholic church - which is known for its crimes (witchhunts etc.) would be the first and loudest to deny so...
Now I really got off on a tangent. But I am ok with that. LOL
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Posted by ( Claylisa ) on April 29, 2008 at 10:20 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Gladiator, ...I imagine that is one thing students ARE praying for in school...to have sex with teacher.
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Posted by ( sb55 ) on May 1, 2008 at 3:52 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
For those of you who do not live day to day in the midst of a public school environment, you should be thankful that somebody on campus is praying. The children of today are not of the same breed as in previous years. Teachers and staff are constantly being cursed at, kicked, whatever. Without the paddling of yester year, there is very little that can be done and unfortunately, some parents don't care. So, with that in mind, thank goodness people are praying in school. If you are self-righteous enough to get on the band wagon about this "no praying in schools b/c it influences the children", then teach your children to be leaders instead of followers. Anytime an announcement is made over the intercom, it is followed by only those who wish to follow. If you don't want your kids being influenced by other people, then home school them. They are going to be influenced whether the teacher/staff prays or not and wherever they are in PUBLIC. What about jewelry and tattoos - are you going to complain about that too? Many Christians do not send their children to Christian schools for various reasons so if you don't want to send your, apparent, un-Christian children to public school, then why don't you create a public school environment for non-believers?? you, know, kind of like The Village. Get real people. As adults, do your co-workers and colleagues influence you because of their beliefs or customs? Do you think yours influence others? Either you stay completely away from people with whom you share nothing or you accept each others differences. You either agree with all this or otherwise, the shoe must fit.
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Posted by ( Navel ) on May 19, 2008 at 1:31 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
cshultz110 writes: "For those of you who believe that this nation was not built on Christianity . . . Please send all of your money (that says "In God We Trust") to 1234 iamabaffoon St., Tampa . . . . SERIOUSLY, this is where we find out how convicted to your belief you really are!!! If you truly believe that this country was not based on Christianity, stop spending money now!!! It goes against your beliefs!!!"
With respect, cshultz, it says "God," not "Christ." Do a bit of research and you'll find that many of the most influential Founding Fathers of our country (including Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, James Madison, etc.) were Deists, NOT Christians in the sense that you're pushing in your post. Check out this link: http://www.sullivan-county.com/id3/debate.htm
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