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Face-Off Fixes On Florida
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Published: February 14, 2008
TAMPA - Even with the voting and candidate boycott now over, the fight over Florida's Jan. 29 presidential primary is only intensifying.
As Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton and Sen. Barack Obama scrap over every convention delegate in a nomination race that's virtually tied, they're arguing over whether delegates chosen by the Florida vote should be seated and their votes counted at August's nominating convention.
So are their allies and other political activists, including civil rights leaders who fear the battle over the nomination could take on a racial tinge.
Clinton led in the two boycotted states of Florida and Michigan, "whose votes we believe should be counted," the New York senator's campaign said in a strategy memo Wednesday.
Obama, though, says it would be unfair to seat those delegates because the candidates didn't campaign in those states, so the outcomes don't reflect a fair test. In Michigan, he notes, only Clinton's name was on the ballot, after the Illinois senator and the other candidates removed theirs.
Both states held primaries before Feb. 5, the earliest date allowed under national party rules for most states. For that reason, the Democratic candidates didn't campaign in Michigan or Florida, and the national party says it won't seat their delegates. Delegates, chosen according to the outcome of the primary, vote for the nominee at the convention.
Decision By Superdelegate Expected
U.S. Sen. Bill Nelson said last week on the Senate floor that the Democratic nomination battle could be headed for "a train wreck" over the issue. He backed off that comment this week, however, saying he thinks unpledged "superdelegates" will break the tie between Obama and Clinton.
Meanwhile, Julian Bond, chairman of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, has joined other civil rights leaders in urging Democratic National Committee chairman Howard Dean to settle the issue of the banned delegates.
If the delegates aren't seated, Bond said in a letter to Dean, "million of voters ... could ultimately have their votes completely discounted," a situation reminiscent of the "sordid history of racially discriminatory primaries."
He said that is "making the voters, including minority voters in Florida particularly, victims of the Republican Legislature in Florida," which set the primary for Jan. 29.
Al Sharpton, flamboyant New York civil rights activist, has taken the other side, arguing that "changing the rules now, and seating delegates from Florida and Michigan at this point would not only violate the Democratic Party's rules of fairness, but also would be a grave injustice."
Bond and Sharpton both say they're neutral in the primary. Nelson backs Clinton.
In Tampa, James Harris Jr., a lawyer and self-described "political junkie" who favors Obama, filed a complaint with the state Division of Elections saying it would amount to elections fraud to seat the Florida delegates.
"Voters might have behaved differently and the candidates might have behaved differently" if Clinton, John Edwards and Obama had fought it out here, he said. "The voters weren't privy to that experience."
A Division of Elections spokesman said Wednesday the complaint was quickly dismissed because the office has no authority or responsibility over seating delegates.
Counts Reveal Thin Margin
It will take 2,025 delegates to win the nomination at the Democratic National Convention in Denver in August, but Clinton and Obama are so close even small numbers could make a difference.
Obama leads with 1,275 delegates to Clinton's 1,220, according to a count by The Associated Press.
That includes "superdelegates," top party and elected officials whose votes aren't decided by the outcome of their state primaries; they vote their own wishes. Many superdelegates haven't yet announced their leanings.
In Florida on Jan. 29, Clinton's 50-33 percent victory earned her 105 pledged delegates to Obama's 67 and 13 for John Edwards. So far, she has a 7-3 lead among Florida's 22 superdelegates, according to the state Democratic Party.
The Clinton campaign says it won another 63 delegates in Michigan.
"Our position is that the people of Michigan and Florida have already weighed in - and their preferences ought to be honored," Clinton campaign spokesman Howard Wolfson said in a conference call with reporters Wednesday.
He noted that a record 1.7 million Democrats turned out for Florida's primary.
The Obama campaign didn't return calls for comment Wednesday, but Obama strategist David Axelrod said Friday, "You can't have rules and then have those rules broken. ...To assign delegates on the basis of those votes would be wholly inconsistent with the rules and with fairness."
Nelson's "train wreck" comment in the Senate last week showed his fears that a convention fight could ensue with a nominee picked by superdelegates "getting in their back rooms deciding, and the turmoil of what to do with Florida and Michigan's delegations."
This week, Nelson said he thinks the superdelegates "will make themselves known" and pick a clear winner before the convention, making the question of whether to seat the banned delegates irrelevant.
Reporter William March can be reached at (813) 259-7761 or wmarch@tampatrib.com.
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Reader Comments
Posted by ( siuchui ) on February 14, 2008 at 1:08 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Barack HUSSEIM Obama was born a Muslim, that is why he was against the war in the first place. Don't be fooled with that, America.
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Posted by ( tsimpson ) on February 14, 2008 at 4:18 a.m.
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Posted by ( dalatorr ) on February 14, 2008 at 4:41 a.m.
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Posted by ( pacfandave ) on February 14, 2008 at 7:20 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I don't see how Julian Bond and Al (remember Tawana Bradley?) Sharpton can play the race card here, since it is Obama who stands to gain if the delegates are NOT seated. Have to agree with dalatorr--Howard Dean and Terry McAuliffe are exactly what's wrong with the Democratic Party. That and the fact that the party is in the firm grip of liberal (translate: socialist) whackos.
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Posted by ( Johnnymac35 ) on February 14, 2008 at 7:47 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
siuchui, you don't really believe that do you? Tell me you and millions of others aren't really influenced by bs emails that are circulated by the GOP. Obama was NEVER a muslim. Talk about a sheeple. It's that kind of ignorance in this country that really scares me. You buy into any fear breeding lie that they tell you. Wake up!
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Posted by ( 1madvet ) on February 14, 2008 at 7:48 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I thought I was the only voter that knew Obama is Muslim. What better way to destroy the U.S. than from within. WAKE UP PEOPLE!
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Posted by ( swtjen ) on February 14, 2008 at 8:12 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I see that racism and ignorance are alive and well in Florida...how sad.
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Posted by ( flbratt ) on February 14, 2008 at 9:27 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Yeah I can tell you I will never say "President Obahma" Not in this life time. It has nothing to do with him being black and more to do with him being muslim. We lost a lot of people on Sep 11 and I am sorry you can call it prejudice against muslims if you want.......then so be it!
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Posted by ( Dave ) on February 14, 2008 at 10:18 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
The party made the rule--let them live by it! The delegates don't count!!
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Posted by ( ron ) on February 14, 2008 at 10:30 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
1madvet wrote>
I thought I was the only voter that knew Obama is Muslim. What better way to destroy the U.S. than from within. WAKE UP PEOPLE!
Response>
What an idiot remark! I guess you also believe that all blacks are criminals, all old people are senile, and all teenagers are trouble makers. Your remark is a sterotype and shows your lack of intelligence and your inability to think for yourself.
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Posted by ( d2d4mate ) on February 14, 2008 at 11:21 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Some of these comments are ridiculous. What does being Muslim have to do with anything? Considering Native American Indians long walked the lands of North America BEFORE our ancestors arrived and basically wiped them out, I think we should refrain from talking about who may or may not be interested in destroying America from within, simply because they are of a certain background. Finally, if some politicians wanted the delegates to be counted, they should have spoken up BEFORE the vote. You can't place a bet after you know the score. Common sense. If so, I would have put 100K on the Giants winning the Superbowl.
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Posted by ( Jasmine501 ) on February 14, 2008 at 11:53 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
A lot of people know Obama is Muslim and a lot of people agree with you 1madvet. However, it's impossible to say who the lesser of two evils is between Clinton & Obama.
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Posted by ( Snot_Funny ) on February 14, 2008 at 12:06 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
First of all, to all the idiots out there who might believe some of the preceding comments: Barack Obama is NOT a Muslim and it wouldn't matter if he was.
Secondly, and most important, Julian Bond is only trying to get the Florida delegates reinstated because he is a Clinton supporter.
Does anyone think that Clinton and her supporters would be fighting to reinstate the delegates if Obama had won in Florida? Of course not! If Clinton and Bond and the rest of them care so much about the voters being disenfranchised, why didn't they start pushing for the delegates to be reinstated LAST FALL? Why wait until it would help her campaign?
The fact is, the Democratic National Committee is not the blame for the delegates being stripped. The blame lies with the Republican-led Florida Legislature. With the amount of delegates Florida has, an early primary would have given us an unfair amount of weight in the nominating process. They were warned of the consequences, and they did it anyway.
The bottom line is, the rules have to be followed and the consequences have to be accepted. Hillary Clinton, just as she did in Nevada, is trying to bypass the rules when they begin to work against her. It's shady behavior, and not very Presidential at all. Or maybe it is...
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Posted by ( Tampa610 ) on February 14, 2008 at 12:27 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Obama is not a muslim. Whatever e-mail you read that in was false. It's sad that people don't fact check but rather rely on some rediculous e-mail or what a friend told them. Obama is a Christian man. Just because someones middle name is muslim in origin..who cares. I know people named Omar, Abdul, Mohammed, etc and they are more Christian than anyone I know. And to think I am a Clinton supporter sticking up for Obama..wow. I just hate to see rumors about anyone. There are a lot of rumors going around about Mcain now. People...read and fact check!!!!!
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Posted by ( Tampa610 ) on February 14, 2008 at 12:30 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Whatever happened to FREEDOM OF RELIGION????? Why do we still persecute and discriminate based on age, race, sex, religion, sexual orientation, etc. Some of you need to come into the 21st Century.
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Posted by ( TinTPA ) on February 14, 2008 at 2:26 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
I can not believe some of the bloggers here!!! How can a person, be it democrat or republican, believe that it is fair that the votes of the people should not count in the process of the electing who their candidate will be, or furthermore, who the next president will be? Do you think that is democratic? Do you really think that is fair???
In my humble opinion it is NOT!!! I call out to Howard Dean, and the DNC to count our votes here in Florida. If our votes were good back in 2000 when G W Bush stole our victory, why is it not good now?
Regardless of what candidate I support, Democracy can not be bent every now and then, much less when it was not the Florida Democratic Party who decided to change the day of the primary.
It is incredible how Republicans still get their way, and people here keep their mouths shut. And you people think that John McCain is going to safeguard the White House???? Ha ha ha Dreamers!!! Well, I'll leave you with that wish that will remain just that...A wish, no more, no less.
The United States is eager to return to times of wealth, security, and fairness (note that non of the previously mentioned have been real for the past 7 years).
Really, think of it, how many of you have lost your homes, your jobs, your peace of mind? Do you think the Clintons, or the Democrats did this???
NO...it was you, those who voted for G W in 2000, and those of you who kept him in the White House.
Any way...I will not continue rambling, some of you, not all, but some, will never have the level of intelligence and maturity it takes to really understand what we have done to our nation.
God Bless you all.
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Posted by ( d2d4mate ) on February 14, 2008 at 2:33 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
TinTPA, the question is not about whether the delegates should be counted. It was determined several MONTHS ago that the delegates would not be counted in Florida and Michigan, because those states moved their primary dates which was contrary to policy). NO ONE, when that decision was made, uttered a word in disagreement. As a consequence, several candidates did not even bother to put their names on the ballot in those states (Hillary is the only one who did in Michigan). So, do you think it would be fair to post hoc, change the rules of the game, simply because the outcome is already known?
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Posted by ( TinTPA ) on February 14, 2008 at 4:21 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
d2d4mate, you are wrong when you say that no one raised their voice in disagreement with what was being proposed. Those of us who do participate in the political process at different levels withing the democratic party did raise our voices. But unfortunatelly, the desition that was made was the wrong one.
Besides that, this is not about what someone in the top leadership of the party decided, it is about giving credit to the voices of over one million americans who went out and voted. It is about doing the right, democratic thing.
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Posted by ( pacfandave ) on February 14, 2008 at 5:31 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Florida Democrats made the decision to violate Democratic Party rules by moving the primary vote ahead. The DNC decided to punish Florida Democrats for violating their rules. I believe the DNC will back down and put this spin on it: "We have heard the voices of the people. We believe Florida Democrats have learned a lesson. We will seat Florida's delegates and welcome them back into the fold." What a bunch of hypocrites!
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Posted by ( TinTPA ) on February 14, 2008 at 5:47 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
pacfandave, apparently you are one of the blind republicans to which I reffered in my first post. Democrats in Florida did not move up the primary date, it was the Republican controlled State Assembly who did knowing the the possible outcome....
Republicans in Florida are nothing but a bunch of scarry cats that will do anything, even if it is risking the democratic rights of those who they govern for the sake of winning an election.
This is really disgusting.
And by the way, who are you to call democrats hyprocrites??? Do I need to remind you who stole the elections in 2000? Do I need to remind you who took this country in to an unnecessary war that has cost us the respect of nations around the globe as well as our economic stability as a nation? Well, in case you can't remember, I will remind you... It was the REPUBLICANS!!!
Now that, my esteemed fellow floridian, is what a hypocrite is.
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Posted by ( Jim55 ) on February 14, 2008 at 9:44 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
You all need to read the court decision reached in Nelson v. Dean. Read it and it is clear that Florida's own state Democratic leadership sided with the Republicans in the statehouse (and against the warnings of the Democratic National Committee), and voted UNANIMOUSLY for the early January 29, 2008 primary date. They tempted the disenfranchisement. When faced with the opportunity to correct the disenfranchisement brought on by any punishment, those same leaders chose to "stay the course" in defying the DNC. There are no scapegoats. Our own D's did it. Now, if this was a coronation of Senator Clinton as was expected, it would be a case of no harm, no foul, and delegates would be seated in the landslide. It was a win/win for the Clinton machine, save money avoiding stops here, use campaign funds elsewhere , then sweep in like a hero and re-seat the delegation. Obama happened, making this an issue, shining light on the fix. The only disenfranchisement was done by your own Democratic "champions" in the legislature.
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Posted by ( kt6905 ) on February 14, 2008 at 10:13 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Barack Obama is a Christian. Those xenophobic bigots on this blog who ignorantly claim he is a muslim and thus worthy of being feared on the other hand are pathetic. Try to read something other than spam email to get your facts. A real American would not spread lies. A real Christian wouldn't spread lies about another Christian. Would Jesus say the kinds of hateful things you have said about Barack Obama?--No. Perhaps you should pray for forgiveness and to find a more loving, truthful path in your lives...shame on you.
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